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McFishin

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Registered: 12/04/08
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Reply with quote  #1 
We've been getting a lot of calls and stop-ins from the public(many thinking the forest service is the dnr...lol) asking about whether or not they need a trout stamp for this reason or that. So, we emailed the DNR in Charleston and this is the response we(Forest Service) got from the DNR's main office. I must admit, this just makes the grey area even bigger...lol..So, basically, unless I'm just blindly missing something, she is saying that unless you keep a trout, you do not ever have to buy a trout stamp.?

"If you do not have a trout stamp and accidentally catch a trout, you must immediately return it to the water. You will not be ticketed unless you place the fish in your creel without holding a trout stamp.

Happy fishing,

Mrs. Kelly Crago

Division of Natural Resources

324 4th Avenue, Building 74

South Charleston, WV 25303

304-558-2784"


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JohnBoat

Rainbow Trout
Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 504
Reply with quote  #2 

“Creel?, what creel I Immediately released them fish into my bucket”

Anglerhead

Brookie
Registered: 12/14/04
Posts: 5,986
Reply with quote  #3 
Her statement says to me that if you are fishing near trout water but not fishing for trout and you accidently hook a trout, you'd better release it if you didn't purchase a trout stamp.



cling

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Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMM
Nobody buys them anyway... and if your never asked to see your "stamp" why buy one?

I meet more and more people every year who don't buy a trout stamp or even a license and they are fishing right there next to me... who just spent over $100 on my license and tags for the year.  



I'd say if you are fishing a stocked river or lake and you are fishing during stocking months, you better have a stamp, regardless of whether or not you have any trout on you. 

In the DNR regs, all i could find that a trout stamp is "required of licensed anglers fishing for trout". 

From WV Code:
§20-2-42o. Class O resident and Class OO nonresident trout fishing stamp.

A Class O stamp is a resident trout fishing stamp. A Class OO stamp is a nonresident trout fishing stamp. These stamps entitle the licensee to fish for trout in all counties of the state, except as prohibited by rules of the Director or Natural Resources Commission.



Its another one of those grey areas in the regulations that I wish were just addressed.  It all comes down to an interpretation of the CO and the judge as to what constitutes "fishing for trout."

I remember going to fish PA several years ago with a friend.  He had a camp on a stream that stocked (approved trout waters)  We were going during July, though.  The regs clearly stated that you needed a trout stamp to fish approved trout waters from like opening day thru june 15th or whenever.  So I knew I didn't need one.  In WV, if I am fishing a pond that is stocked with trout during stocking months, but I'm fishing for bass in August, do I need a stamp?  My guess for that is no, but what if i'm fishing for bass there on May 30th? 

MD's regs are pretty clear on when you do and do not need a trout stamp as well...anyplace stocked or anywhere that is a special regulation area, regardless of whether or not you plan to keep any fish.

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McFishin

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Reply with quote  #5 

Quote:
Originally Posted by cling
Its another one of those grey areas in the regulations that I wish were just addressed. 

^^DITTO!

I remember going to fish PA several years ago with a friend.  He had a camp on a stream that stocked (approved trout waters)  We were going during July, though.  The regs clearly stated that you needed a trout stamp to fish approved trout waters from like opening day thru june 15th or whenever.  So I knew I didn't need one.  In WV, if I am fishing a pond that is stocked with trout during stocking months, but I'm fishing for bass in August, do I need a stamp?  My guess for that is no, but what if i'm fishing for bass there on May 30th? 

MD's regs are pretty clear on when you do and do not need a trout stamp as well...anyplace stocked or anywhere that is a special regulation area, regardless of whether or not you plan to keep any fish.


As I understand it from talking to the CO's(and I've actually got this from more than 1) Regardless of what your intended species is, if you are fishing an area such as a section of a stream that recieves trout or a pond/lake that receives trout during the time stocking is occurring, you need a stamp. So, regardless of what lures your using(say, someone throwing musky plugs in a tailwater that is stocked) you still need a trout stamp. LOL! If they are not stocking then you do not have to have a trout stamp. However, after they told me this and I've thought about it more, then going by that logic one does not need a trout stamp to fish Cranberry or somewhere like that(which is pretty much all trout) from June on. I think there's too many grey area's, like you said.

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Rick

Brookie
Registered: 12/15/04
Posts: 5,965
Reply with quote  #6 
Wow, how cheap are some people?


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cling

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Reply with quote  #7 
Quote:
additionally from the WV Code:

"Fishing" or "to fish" means the taking, by any means, of fish, minnows, frogs or other amphibians, aquatic turtles and other forms of aquatic life used as fish bait.

"Take" means to hunt, shoot, pursue, lure, kill, destroy, catch, capture, keep in captivity, gig, spear, trap, ensnare, wound or injure any wildlife, or attempt to do so: Provided, That the definition of "take" does not include an officially sanctioned and properly licensed field trial, water race or wild hunt as long as that field trial is not a shoot-to-retrieve field trial.


Given these definitions and the law i stated earlier...if you catch a trout....you have "taken" it.  To take a trout means you haved fished for it according to the definition above of "fishing"...whether knowingly or not.  And to fish for a trout you need a stamp.  I can easily see that justification being used to prosecute anyone catching a trout without a stamp, anytime, anywhere.


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retired48

Brookie
Registered: 10/25/06
Posts: 2,284
Reply with quote  #8 

What's the stamp cost--$10.00.  Most of the stock chasers spend more than that on a couple jars of power bait and a six-pack to leave along the stream!

grant4

Brown Trout
Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 1,789
Reply with quote  #9 

I know a CO who does not feel you need a trout stamp to fish a C and R area because you can not keep the fish anyway?  Just thought i'd throw that out there.  Everyone I fish with buys them, as do I.  Like i've stated before i would gladly pay double to get to fish for trout in some of the fine waters we have in WV and I haven't kept one in several years.  Grant4

campnfisher

Tiger Trout
Registered: 03/04/09
Posts: 1,558
Reply with quote  #10 
Clear as mud.....  I haven't kept a trout in quite a few years and I buy mine every year.  Would there be a way to develop/issue two types of licenses, one for warmwater, one for both, that would encompass the proper stamps?  Same price as now, but clearly differentiates the two.  They have already put the National forest stamp into the general license, or at least the fee they used to charge.  Would this even help?  Similar to the inland and saltwater licenses of coastal states.  That way there is no confusion and those who try to skirt the system couldn't do so easily.  I know there are a bunch of folks who fish warmwater exclusively, where there are no trout (my dad for one)....bass fisherman in big lakes, strictly musky fisherman, etc.   Just curious....
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REB

Brown Trout
Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 1,969
Reply with quote  #11 

It would be nice if you could buy an optional trout stamp for $30 that allowed you to bring a bucket to edray 3 days a week and have it filled with 6 trout in exchange for swearing not to fish the rest of the day.  That would solve a lot of problems.

ejunk

Brookie
Registered: 04/19/05
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Reply with quote  #12 
you should post the email you sent her, McFishin as the gray area may be in your question rather than her answer. no offense intended.

yrs-
Evan!


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McFishin

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Reply with quote  #13 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ejunk
you should post the email you sent her, McFishin as the gray area may be in your question rather than her answer. no offense intended.

yrs-
Evan!

A guy I work with was the one who actually sent the question, as we were talking about it and then I had to go clear trails. While I was gone he emailed her. He just forwarded me her answer. I believe he said his quesiton was(because he asked me the same question), "If I am bass fishing in the South Branch, North Fork SB, etc(anywhere else for bass) and catch a trout(or am fishing in an area where trout are known but bass are readily present also) and a CO would happen to see me, would I get a ticket?"


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wvcoop78

Musky
Registered: 12/12/10
Posts: 1,045
Reply with quote  #14 

All these responses solidify Mcfishin's definition of a "grey area".  I don't question paying the $10 for a trout stamp b/c I'm helping to provide funds to help, in some way, to protect and help our state's fisheries.  With that said, if you're fishing a stocked stream, without a trout stamp, and were using baits like trout magnets, power bait, or eggs, it would be hard to explain that you weren't fishing for trout...and that you accidentally caught one, even if you immediately released it.  My opinion is to just pay the $10, it's in some way going to a good cause. 


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TCFlyFisher

Largemouth Bass
Registered: 08/06/07
Posts: 892
Reply with quote  #15 
Why wouldn't you buy one if you were a trout fisherman? I guess people want the resource but don't want to pay the big bucks to use it. 
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TroutSlayer

Brookie
Registered: 02/10/07
Posts: 2,083
Reply with quote  #16 

cheap enough to complain about $10......it adds up to $100.00 every ten yrs...not everyone likes to waste money if they don't have too...I wasn't brought up to throw away hard earned money...


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secondcreekjunkie

Rainbow Trout
Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 670
Reply with quote  #17 
ive learned over the years just cause one guy hasn't bought a stamp in 10 years and got by with....doesnt mean i need to do it....45 dollars to fish.......i have no prob with that...now if i could just find hunting grounds for 45 id be a happy man

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TroutSlayer

Brookie
Registered: 02/10/07
Posts: 2,083
Reply with quote  #18 

I'm not complaining about purchasing the stamp, but if I don't have to I'm not going to.......


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HaroldJohanson

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Registered: 01/11/11
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Reply with quote  #19 

I always buy the trout stamp. That way I don't feel so guilty when I take a few home.


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Bryan

Musky
Registered: 03/26/06
Posts: 1,010
Reply with quote  #20 

I don't mind the $10 for the trout itself, but the $2 issuing fee to do it online kind of bothers me.

curmudgeon

Musky
Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 1,210
Reply with quote  #21 

The trout stamp is the sole source of income for the entire WV Trout program -- put and take trout stocking, brown trout fingerlings for pusedo wild fisheries, and any wild trout programs. It is not an entitlement to taking six trout per day.

If you don’t buy the trout stamp you are only robbing from yourself.

ccaldwell

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Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 2,264
Reply with quote  #22 
Plain pathetic to enjoy the resource and not pay $10.

If you are on the greenbrier at alderson and catch a trout and don't have a trout stamp let it go no biggie.  If you are in an area stocked by the state or any other water that gets state funded stocking buy a stamp.  I am sure if you have money to put gas in a car to go fish right now $10 won't be to hard to rake up. 
REB

Brown Trout
Registered: 12/28/04
Posts: 1,969
Reply with quote  #23 
Quote:
Originally Posted by curmudgeon

The trout stamp is the sole source of income for the entire WV Trout program -- put and take trout stocking, brown trout fingerlings for pusedo wild fisheries, and any wild trout programs. It is not an entitlement to taking six trout per day.

If you don’t buy the trout stamp you are only robbing from yourself.

$10 for 6 trout/day is a horrible deal for the state.  They probably cost a couple of bucks each to raise to adulthood.

wonderwear

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Reply with quote  #24 

People will cry about anything if given the chance. Charge everybody $7 more for a base license and do away with the stamp and confusion all together, and at the same time increase the fisheries budget.


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ccaldwell

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Posts: 2,264
Reply with quote  #25 

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^Not a bad idea ^^^^^^^^^^^^

Rick

Brookie
Registered: 12/15/04
Posts: 5,965
Reply with quote  #26 
Quote:
Originally Posted by curmudgeon
The trout stamp is the sole source of income for the entire WV Trout program -- put and take trout stocking, brown trout fingerlings for pusedo wild fisheries, and any wild trout programs. It is not an entitlement to taking six trout per day.


DING, DING, DING!!! We have a winner.

Excellent post, Tony!


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"The hills resound with the sounds of Mountaineer football and the West Virginia University Mountaineers are on the air!"
Jack Fleming, Legend

"Fishing, with me, has always been an excuse to drink in the daytime."
Jimmy Cannon

Dobber

Walleye
Registered: 01/17/10
Posts: 216
Reply with quote  #27 

The Law Sounds pretty clear to me.  It is all about "intent".If you are fishing for Trout, you must have a trout stamp.  It's up to the common sense of a CO/NRP and the judicial system as to prosecution.  If you are in a stocked trout stream using power bait it wouldn't be hard to assume you are trout fishing for trout and articulate a complaint to a magistrate.  However, if you are fishing Sutton Tailwaters (regularly stocked) with a Cobb Musky Magnum Jerk Bait, common sense should prevail as to enforcement.  Again, as someone else touched on, if you are going to take advantage of the trout fishing in WV and think you're not obligated to buy the stamp simply because you don't keep them, than I say "that's weak". 

Outsider

Brookie
Registered: 06/20/06
Posts: 3,371
Reply with quote  #28 
I have said on another thread, we in wv are very fortunate to pay such low fees for hunting and fishing liscenses. I would gladly pay double or triple the fees if the additional money went to further improve our nat resources. I buy a bear stamp every year, have never even hunted a bear in my 23 years of hunting, but I am very happy to have bought the tag to help with bear research on our state. I happily buy the trout stamp even though I dont trout fish that much, look at it this way. that 10 dollars may have stocked a few fish at coonskin park for handicapped folks, and maybe it helped put a smile on a wheelchair bound kid or adult, you know sometimes you should not think about just yourself and the inconvience the 10 dollar trout stamp cost you. If you don't want to buy the tag, then don't, but dont dare comPlain if you get a ticket and have to go to court. I don't care if I ruffeled anyones feathers with this post and it was nOt aimed at anyone in partiular.
ejunk

Brookie
Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 6,887
Reply with quote  #29 
this may have already been mentioned, but I'm pretty sure if a CO catches you on a stream that receives trout stockings and you don't have a trout stamp they're gonna ticket you.

and if they don't, they should.

as an aside, I was at a local bow shop the other day and overheard a conversation between some guys. they were denouncing "otherwise upright citizens" who thought nothing of poaching trout or taking more than their limits or not buying stamps, etc, etc. glad to hear this kind of talk in public. you may not agree with management strategies or other DNR policies, but intentionally defying natural resources law is selfish, disrespectful and ignorant. 

yrs-
Evan!

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cling

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Reply with quote  #30 
outsider and ejunk---well said both of you!

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http://www.mountaineerchronicles.blogspot.com
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